Israel/Palestine thread

Still not worth dying for.

I agree we can only act on what we believe. The problem is conditions can change leading to a change of beliefs. There are a lot of Japanese people who might have thought fighting the Americans until death was the right thing to do. Many who didn’t act on this went on to greater things.

I would never consider dying for my beliefs because I could be wrong.

Would you consider dying for Elway’s beliefs?

I would think that as a Christian you would not want to say that someone could die for a belief that is wrong and be right relative to what they believe. That would seem to undermine free choice and divine command. Certainly it was not lack of exposure to divine truth that would make Nasrallah choose to commit himself to fight for Islam.

I mean everything you are saying makes sense from a compatibilist/naturalist PoV but you’re kind of borrowing from my worldview for this one no? 😉

The issue is when you decide to die or kill for your beliefs, you're involving and killing others who dont agree with or share your beliefs.

How did that work out for him?

It worked out better for him than the meaningful amount of folks who knew he was douch canoe and ended up also dying, largely as a result of his tribalistic desires. Nas gets his reward and everyone elae is just dead.

I don’t even understand the argument. Guy died therefore wrong?

Being eliminated by the Jews has to hurt.

You are correct, I would NOT want to say that, I wasn't trying to say that.

Within Reformed Theology there is a form of Compatiblism, specifically that predestination and free-will can both be true at the same time.

There is a technique in close-up magic that illustrates that idea in a crude form called Equivocation or 'Magician's Choice.'

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Forcing_(m...

Equivocation

Equivocation (or the magician's choice) is a verbal technique by which a magician gives an audience member an apparently free choice but frames the next stage of the trick in such a way that each choice has the same end result.[2]

An example of equivocation can be as follows: A performer deals two cards on a table and asks a spectator to select one. If the spectator chooses the card on the left, the performer will hand the card to the spectator. If they pick the card on the right, the performer will take that card as his own and have the other card be the spectator's. In either case, the spectator receives the intended card.

One particularly widely used form of equivocation uses books, and is known by its own name, the book test.

You really think he didn't expect that to happen?

These people are very stupid and optimistic. He was very aware it could happen which is why he spent most of his adult life living under ground. What’s true is that he never got to see victory. He only saw his movement get weaker and weaker.

Are you actually as ignorant as you sound about this conflict or are you just a complete troll?

the Jewish colonizers still have not taken over Lebanon. when they turn the South into the West Bank and Zionists are taking molly and doing rape in Beirut then you can start crowing.

Do you agree that Gaza is only a launch pad to attack Israel?

Do you agree that nothing good is built in Gaza?

When did the Jews become colonizers?

Do you agree that the Arab nations contributed to a real genocide (The Holocaust) by refusing to allow the Jews to have their own land? They were allowed to establish their own nations after WW1 but wouldn’t allow the Jews even a tiny sliver of land. What do you think of this real genocide?

Would you all agree that the Palestinians need to stop blaming Israel for their miserable lives and actually start coming up with solutions to better themselves?

I don’t think Israelis have ever viewed themselves as victims. Isn’t it interesting that every empire that ever tried to destroy Israel no longer exists. Israel still remains standing. I predict that eventually the Palestinians will no longer exist. The word Palestine was hijacked by the Arabs in the first place. Nobody in the region cares about the Palestinians. Arab countries are realizing Israel is not the problem.

The nation of Israel didn't exist from roughly 70 A.D. until 1948 A.D.

my grandpa won the 1948 national championship in pasadena california

really solid year iyam

They exist now but the empires that tried to destroy them do not.

It's the effects of the war machine and propaanda - whether it's the US, Iran, Russia or every civilization in human history.

I'll take a wild guess that you haven't served in the military, but martyrdom is a real thing in every army. Soldiers purposefully staying behind to expose themselves when the feel they've got nothing left to live for ... military jargon promoting "never surrender" or "band of brothers"

That critical line is crossed when that belief is extended to the point of justifying or accepting the risk of harm to innocent civilians in pursuit of those objectives - especially when the one's calling the shots for others are the ones holding the leverage while also holding the guns. It's a cancerous mindset that infects every side and the civilians who want nothing to do with it pay the price.

...I'd imagine that you've at least watched Leitentant Dan in Forest Gump. that behavior is rabid strong

Well imo that might be worse since it possibly makes God the author of evil, but I don’t want to derail another thread with a discussion on religion.

Neither of these things are true. Actually it’s amazing what Palestinians were able to do given they were under the thumb of Hamas (partially by their own choice but still).

Why don’t you give me some examples of what the Palestinians have been able to do. Also, give me some examples of anything good built in Gaza. I know you like your chat gtp.

What have these people ever done for the betterment of the world?

Palestinians are a fake people. If someone spoke of the Palestinians in the 1920’s or 30’s they were referring to the Jews. The so called Palestinians are just Arabs who didn’t go live in one of the newly formed Arab states. It’s the Arabs who hijacked the name Palestinian and used these people as their pawns. There never has been and never will be a nation of Palestine.