Bodybuilding Classic Physique Division Offseason log

Nope. I stopped doing any unpaid coaching work a while ago.

Switched jobs. Long story don't ask. Lower stress/more time to bodybuild/coach. 4 weeks into a cut where I'm frankly just not trying hard and I'm already looking like this. Yeah I made a handful of important breakthroughs on food. No competition coming just cleaning up bodyfat for around 12 weeks before the next bulk where once again I'll take it with a small surplus and a long duration of bulking and maintain more leanness. Hamstrings are already showing a lot of detail even at 96kg where last time I needed to get sub 90 for them to pop out at all. But I'll spare you the gay pics.

I use a nubia red magic 9 phone because I used to like to play nintendo switch emulated games on there. It has a dogshit camera. This is the first time I had somebody take pictures of me using a high quality camera phone. Normally I just use a tripod, video, and screenshot. NGL it looks pretty cinematic and epic and ****.

Anyway yeah my life is basically entirely oriented around doing a pro qualifier around 20 months from now. Nov 2027/Dec 2027 2 shows.

First (of hopefully many) client gold medal men's open superheavyweight bodybuilding. His first show. Former fatty/obese guy who was literally 135kg in high school 187ish cm. He's only 30 so probably around 5-7 years from now he'll be at pro qualifier level for men's open SHW.

I was talking about it with Syndr0me, but bodybuilding requires far more time and patience than olympic lifting. If you start PEDs early and don't use ******ed late 2000s era programming, you're gonna total 400kg @ 94 within 5-7 years of starting training (assuming you're starting before age ~24 or so). The reason why this didn't happen more was ******ed ideas about programming and low PED use in olytard among westerners. Lu Xiaojun went from first day training to olympic champion in less than a decade. Ilya Illin went from first day of training to WWC champ in what... 6-7 years?

Bodybuilding timelines? lol... Brandon curry starting bbing in like 1998, pro in 2009, and olympia in 2019. A very typical timeline is about a decade of full bodybuilding life (not just when you start training, not even when you start PEDs, but when you start meal prepping and tracking food/eating on a plan year round or close to it) before you turn pro as a heavyweight or superheavyweight with basically nobody doing it faster and many people taking 15 years or so. That's just to turn pro... then several more years to qualify for an Olympia. Then several more to actually place well in the Olympia or win it. For classic physique and men's physique or bodybuilding in lighter weight classes for shorter guys, the timelines are more forgiving but this takes an unbelievable amount of patience and low time preference.

Anyway I really love my job and life and location and being next to my cousin. I don't really wanna do coaching full time. I want to get like ~20-30 clients, cap it there, and keep grinding my economics teaching job but make more $ doing something I love on the side. Having literally nothing but bodybuilding on your mind isn't great and I do like to actually use my brain for other things and the kids at this school are curious and want to talk about real economics things here and there, although we still spend 90% of our energy maximizing exam score which is fine and standard. I get the sense some of them "need" me in some ways too. Use your imagination about the typical kind of person who becomes a high school teacher and why somebody like me might feel very refreshing to a 16-18 year old boy especially.

The client above dropped a staggering 26kg over a 22 week contest prep. The lesson that even I often fail to truly internalize is "You're gonna have to lose more weight than you think to be in true stage conditioning". That's partly why I'm not doing a show this year; I'm ripped AF in the above photo but if I wanted to be as conditioned as my client I'd probably still have another painful and difficult 7-8kg to lose. Last show I was "good", but not world class. And after having done this 3 times already I'm not going to even step on stage unless I'm bringing "world class" level conditioning.

Villagery pop in:

Glad things seem to be going well. Saw this graph and thought about your musings over the years:

Polygyny is so back baby.

https://www.richardhanania.com/p/stop-trying-to-make-heterosexuals

richardhanania

Stop Trying to Make Heterosexuals into Lesbians

Basically the argument is that society should accept that heterosexual men and women generally dont have that much in common, probably aren't going to be best friends and soulmates a lot of the time. And a lot of relationships are going to be transactional, and that is fine. And we shouldn't be shaming transactional relationships, eg. old man/young woman.

by Dunyain m

Villagery pop in:Glad things seem to be going well. Saw this graph and thought about your musings over the years:Polygyny is so back baby.

https://www.richardhanania.com/p/stop-trying-to-make-heterosexuals

richardhanania

Stop Trying to Make Heterosexuals into Lesbians

--Also, this is an interesting essay written by a Substack guy I follow ($5/month). I have shared his work before. He isn't the deepest thinker, but he approaches stuff fr... See full post

Cool, time to go bang and impregnate my 16 year old student.

I have a lot of thoughts on this, sorry they are poorly organized, tangential, and only partly connected but you know how I am...

I'm familiar with Hanania, he's okay. Can be a bit annoying on his videos with Rob. But Rob is also kinda annoying sometimes. These guys just don't push things far enough and seem to be going in the right direction largely but aren't willing to be offensive or "extreme" even when that really just means "realistic.

I agreed right up until he started talking about blackpill/Clavicular. No... Looks are extremely important for the men and women in the 16-24 age bracket as money isn't a factor yet at those ages for 99.x% of people and status is near entirely derived from genetic physical characteristics in that phase of life. It is NOT just a mirrored projection of gay male preferences onto females and he's very quick to dismiss hordes of empirical data on the importance of looks (while simultaneously attributing it to dating apps, as if these shift female preferences rather than simply reveal them). In the age bracket where humans are most fertile, looks and physicality completely dominate mate choice. Later, they become "necessary but not sufficient" in my age bracket where women paradoxically have the highest expectations overall despite the peak value largely being over. And then as people get over 40 its more like "just don't be obese or disfigured". But even then, straight male prostitution is quite common in Japan, Korea, and Thailand (not China or I'd be getting more surgeries, lifting and roiding a lot less, and outta my current profession). Are the men CEO dominant bosses seen ordering people around and flashing symbols of wealth? The symbols of wealth part, actually yes slightly. But they're largely androgynous males with naturally masculine dimorphic facial features mixed with a feminine/prettyboi presentation. Think Felix from Stray Kids.

When women are pursuing hot orgasms they are not fantasizing about 38 year old wealthy startup founders who drive a porsche. They're fantasizing about the types of very beautiful moderately feminized men above. The fact that women on average have libidos that are about 1/9th of men's coupled with relative mating market advantage (relative scarcity of fertile aged women as a % of the population compared to previous eras) allows them to choose between utilitarian relationships with more powerful/wealthy men or choose hot orgasm men. Women aren't a monolith and I'm sure the distribution of sex drive/libido is even more heterogeneous among women than it is among men. I'd contest that the types that would choose the more utilitarian path are also the ones who have lower libidos and the ones who pursue hot orgasms over money/status are the higher libido types. If you are a higher libido man, choosing the path to make yourself attractive in the utilitarian sense is a very losing strategy and the looksmaxxing path basically acts as somewhat of a filter.

That said, can money/status independently produce involuntary sexual arousal? The blackpill/clavicular crew would say "no, it's all just betabux and she's going to divorce you and spend your money on chad and have sex with him 3-4x/day while you had to beg for dutiful sex twice per week". I would disagree and once again reference empirical data showing higher perceived physical attractiveness when men are portrayed as higher status or pictured next to luxury cars or apartments. In other words, money/status to produce arousal, but not consciously and rather women just perceive the same man as different levels of physical attractiveness based on presentation and context.

My own working theory: Men climb intra-sex hierarchies for access to mates. Women mate-choice is heavily influenced by which men allow them to more effectively compete in intra-sex hierarchies. In modern parlance, men try to mog other men to **** women. Women **** men in order to mog other women. The end goal for women is being the top female in her peer group/society broadly. The status is the end itself for them. For men, the status is nice but its largely a means to an end, and the end is cumming in young fertile hot babes.

Tangentially related: I've discovered first-hand that while I think commentators like Hanania overstate the importance of money/status in attraction while understating looks, they probably even understate how important money/status are in actually maintaining relationships. Even young couples formed on mutual primal desire where the woman is attracted to the man for non-utilitarian reasons and he's giving the best orgasms she could possibly get and she has no superior options in terms of physicality and sex, she will not want to settle down and have a family with this dude if he isn't able to cover whatever she perceives as basic financial requirements. That could range from "food, shelter, eat out when we want, vacation once a year with the kids" to "luxury handbags monthly, porsche, multiple properties" and there's probably a moderate but not overwhelmingly strong correlation between the woman's attractiveness and her financial expectations.

I'd personally much rather be in a relationship where the woman primally desired me and we would sometimes bang 4-5x/day but eventually leaves because I just don't make enough $ and she has equivalent or even higher socioeconomic status (has happened) than be with a woman who feels low primal desire for me but loves how much higher my social status and income can provide a huge upgrade in her lifestyle and I overall don't feel satisfied with the amount of sex, it feels like i'm hiring a prostitute, and eventually I bail. (has also happened...)

Another partly related tangent: Men's stated preferences often say **** like "bro men don't care about a woman's degrees or money". This is empirically false. It is much easier for a woman to get a high status/wealthy man if she herself is high status/income. And it isn't strictly because of higher exposure. To what extent this is due to the cultural stigma of men dating too far down the SES/age ladder is unknown to me, but I'm sure it contributes.

Anyway, I find this all very interesting to think about as a removed observer. My own desire to find a partner has never been lower. I want to facking win the Chinese nationals in December 2027 and in my current market basically any woman I'm actually attracted to is going to derail and sabotage that goal. Shenzhen is 130 male to 100 female and if you looked at only marrying age/unmarried people I'm sure it gets to something even more wildly imbalanced with all the old menopausal grandmas and huge glut of educated high income male tech sector workers. Even if something formed, she's going to be so domineering and with such outrageously high expectations that I completely lose my identity and autonomy. And this is just sorta the norm in Shenzhen when women are so much scarcer than men. I'm very okay with this. I was in and out of relationships constantly from 2020-2024 with only one of those lasting more than a year. I want a break. I'd be very open to another non-Chinese if the right one appeared, it's just Chinese girls in Shenzhen I'm avoiding.

Back to the original article mentioning people saying things that sound nice but fail empirically: "bro just wait, the right one will come when you aren't looking" yeah that advice works for women because their process of looking involves negative filtering. When they stop looking, they also stop disqualifying based on arbitrary gay criteria and intimacy starts to organically form. It doesn't work for men where it's a way more active process. I was treating dating like a part time job in that aforementioned era. If you want to find a partner you just gotta put in way more time and energy as a male compared to whatever your baseline is (currently negative, actively avoiding repeated encounters).

by Dunyain m

Villagery pop in:Glad things seem to be going well. Saw this graph and thought about your musings over the years:Polygyny is so back baby.

https://www.richardhanania.com/p/stop-trying-to-make-heterosexuals

richardhanania

Stop Trying to Make Heterosexuals into Lesbians

--Also, this is an interesting essay written by a Substack guy I follow ($5/month). I have shared his work before. He isn't the deepest thinker, but he approaches stuff fr... See full post

what am I missing? How do these numbers add up?

There's a clear correlation between the gap in childlessness between men and women due to soft-polygynous arrangements. Not open harems, just serial monogamy. I'd take it with a grain of salt and say it might be less inceldom/women choosing only top men and more that the types of men who would ever gravitate toward extreme leftist are broke af with no income to have kids. And a generally widespread anti-natalist ideological bend. At least that's what I inferred as the most important takeaway, I'll let the man speak for himself.

Although I'm very far to the right of even what this poll labels as "extremely conservative", I'm in that 22% largely for my inability to tolerate sharing my life with a woman and a bit too much desire for sovereignty while lacking the level of elite status and wealth required to have both sovereignty and a partner. Spending 8 or more hours per day the last decade being a surrogate dad to a bunch of chinese teenagers has also served as very effective birth control.
.

so women are prefer to mate/breed with higher quality men even if they are also/have had children with other women already while less attractive men don't get a look in?

No I personally actually don't think that's what the chart is saying. I'm just trying to interpret the "polygny is so back' statement made by another poster.

Dun,

lol. I do find it funny that there is a depiction of the far right being incels when virtually every far right movement has consisted of turning women into breeding vessels for our great state.

Feel,

Its the imbalance between childless men/women broadly across society, given the medians and averages, its pretty hard to even shoehorn in a counterexample where it could be possible without widespread multiple baby daddies (to a greater extent than women). This largely makes biological sense, and then we have homies like Elon Musk who make Tyreek Hill look lazy.

Guy,

I think that is a reasonably accurate interpretation of the underlying data and behavior that people have. Also, there is some evidence that it is difficult to sustain marriages when one party is meaningfully different in IQ than the other. This is one of the things that many normies struggle with when they try to use shorthand like degrees or other indicators of intelligence rather than actually being intelligent (not that its perfectly quantifiable, but a lot of PhD dropouts aren't because they couldn't hack it). Eventually dudes tire of their trophy wives and realize all the stuff they liked about them doesn't exist and instead they're shepherding a 50y old child through life when they could get a much hotter 25-30y old child to manage.

So yeah, people are dumb and make dumb decisions.

BTW I've being watching Euphoria S03. Its amazing. Its like Starship Troopers (the movie) where the writer intends to make a statement and ends up making the opposite statement. I'm watching Hunter Schafer who is now a sugar baby make awkward comments to her sugar daddy about banging troons then getting wrapped in saran wrap (half naked) so we can see she has huge fake tits now. Peak unintentional comedy.

Yeah. I would interpret the data as suggesting the amount of men having offspring with multiple women is much higher than vice versa (as Guy states, this wouldn't typically be a haram situation. It would be more something like some number of males having a couple children with one woman when they are both in their 20s-30s, then starting a new family when he is in his late 30s-40s with a younger woman)

And to make the math work more men than women (typically more politically liberal) are leaving no offspring at all. Ironically, DNA evidence suggests that prehistorically 1/2 of men did not have children at all, so if anything our modern condition softens the "natural" state, which is more explicitly polygynous haram situations.

Also, in fairness some liberal men will be starting families at 45+ years of age, so surveying them from age 35-45 will be missing some of them. But this will be a small number and wont move the needle much IMO.

Also, although you identify as conservative, from a psychological perspective I would say you are more of a typical liberal. In that you are neurotic, overthink things, and overly picky in who you choose to 'mate' with. Which is a big reason you have never had any offspring. Most "conservative" persons in your life situation wouldn't be so neurotic or think things through so much. They would just settle, start a family, and lead a life of quiet middle class desperation. And like you said, IF you had ended up higher status/more wealthy you probably would have ended up procreating anyways on your own terms.

I am not saying this as an insult or to be degrading. Just my honest thoughts, that may or may not be correct.

Some have argued, as I have articulated in this forum multiple times over the years in various ways, that is basically the whole point of "trad" human societies. And our own society is falling apart because we are missing this point.

Basically, high status men get low status men to buy in and let them be in charge by creating social structures where low status men can mate with low status women (with variable degree of agency on the females part). And voila. You have a "trad" society that more or less works.

And when you give low status women too much agency, leading to low status men not getting enough pussy, the whole thing falls apart.

I enjoyed Season 1. Season 2 was a slog. Too much of a focus on Rue's drug addiction, which was just depressing and made the watching experience not particularly enjoyable. Will start Season 3 at some point, but no great urgency.

I have some thoughts on this that I will get back to when I have more time. But for now, I will point out that your musings on general female sexuality take for granted extremely modern social/technological innovations, including but not limited to:

1. Modern welfare state
2. Political stability and lack of violence, both inter-tribal and intra-tribal.
3. Extended adolescence
4. Birth control

--And because none of these things existed for our evolutionary history (until the last second) it stands to reason female human sexuality evolved under much more constraining circumstances. That being said, given pretty much universal female sexual attraction to visible male beauty standards; it stands to reason during our evolutionary history young fertile females had some agency in mate selection, and acted upon visual cues of reproductive fitness you describe. But the idea that in evolutionary times childless 16 year old females were having casual sex with the most physically attractive young man they could get their hands on to the extent such behavior was strongly selected for, seems dubious at best.

These things are here and aren't going away, and if anything, they are expanding. So who cares about the cases when these aren't present lol

Are they?

There seems to be a pretty strong correlation, if not outright causation, between social liberalness and birth rates well below replacement level. At some point obviously this wont be sustainable anymore. Maybe technology will step in and offer a way out without social liberalness being compromised. But I wouldn't say this is a certainty.

I dont think it is obvious that in 50-100 years most humans are going to be living in societies where attractive young women in the height of their fertile window will have the freedom/power modern liberal society confers them, especially to engage in casual sex with multiple partners (strongly selecting for physical attractiveness) while on birth control.

I generally agree with that. Moreso that many men identified or called "incels" generally have evidence of having many babby. And when go far right dystopian like Nazis or the Handmaid's Tale, this gets way way out there.

Its just amusing and a minor observation.

It has gone completely off the rails. It is a great unintentional comedy now.

What does everyone think about stopping mail order birth control? Other than the fact that most countries with liberal abortion policies pretty much require multiple touch points with an actual doctor in addition to being in a facility for an abortion since we actually don't wanna kill people (or have crazy people get birth control and give it to other people). As a quick explainer how this works in the first world:

1) See you doctor. Xem verifies you are, in fact, pregnant and not just fat with indigestion.
2) You come back at some time later for your first dose of drugs.
3) You come back the next day and take second batch of drugs. You hang out till you poop out babby.
4) Assuming no complications, you go home. But mostly they make sure you pooped all the babby out so you don't die of sepsis or have some other related issue.

To me this seems pretty sane. Abortions become more restricted post 12/14 weeks depending on where you are across Yurop since everyone knows they're pregnant by then and is deciding to keep the babby. The whole 18-22 week issue in the US is widely viewed as absurd. Of course if you're legit insane and engaging in self-harm, they'll send you to the looney bin and give you an abortion. But I can't really wrap my mind around the reasons you'd ever need to get a mail order abortion. But I can definitely think of some extremely negative ones (hiding incest, sex slavery, killing someone else's babby, etc) that could occur from widespread dissemination of abortifacients.

oh okay, I was thinking more time myopically like these things aren't going away *in our lifetime*. But when I read this post it does sorta change my mind. Let's be edgy and compare Weimar Republic woman to 1950s women. The reversal can indeed be swift... and America has never looked closer to collapse than ever before. Note that the most recent Trump would-be assassin has had shockingly little info about his motivation released. Maybe he's not a deranged TDS "anti-racist" leftoid and is actually motivated by Iran war+epstein corruption and they certainly don't want to put that out there (fwiw I think these 2 combined are absolutely legitimate reasons to violently overthrow the US government and burn the constitution/nuke Tel-Aviv/ give war reparations to Iran/expel some people, and I reckon a large portion of Gen Z and Gen A males agree and don't exactly have much to lose). Thank you for all the posts, big dawg.

I'm doing really good lol. Honestly loving the new job like I've posted about before. I just did not appreciate how much larping deference (really more like reverence) to midwit IQ hyper-credentialed middle aged Lawful Evil rules and procedures obsessed middle aged women all day long was hurting my QOL overall. Free time good, pay good, salary progression good, side business good, bodybuilding better than I could have ever expected.

Reading Kevin MacDonald's trilogy. Book 3 is unfortunately banned in the USA and it's too irrelevant to Chinese people to find a copy here. My cousin got his hands on "A people that shall dwell alone" and it is absolutely fascinating. Also finished George Bataille's "The Accursed Share" which was a bit dry in some places but still had some unique insights I hadn't thought about. Re-read Jeff Booth's book, it's sorta alright but kinda what I'd give a newbie/my mom to try and explain modern monetary system to somebody who's basically on step 0 right now.

I was so crunched for time and frayed/burnt out at my previous job doing fake make-work box ticking while teaching only 16 classes per week getting yelled at for the most minor **** ever that the idea of reading for pleasure or making irrelevant posts on 2p2 was inconceivable. Nowadays though, taking a 30% before tax income hit but gaining ~25+ hours per week and much lower stress here I am actually able to think about the world again.

just under 90kgs here. another show probably in the works June 7. It's just a low pressure/fun/ez show nothing super competitive and huge like last go-around. My glutes are showing lines for the first time ever in my bbing career, but I will spare you the pics because I don't want to scare Dunyain away with the uncomfortable ****-eroticism.

Are you confusing me with someone else? Why in the world would you think ****-eroticism would make me uncomfortable? Remember, I am the one that had a picture of Ronnie Coleman's ass as my avatar. Be my guest and show as much dong-thong as you desire.

Also, the last would-be Trump assassin had a manifesto, which was published by the media. No one is really covering anything up. He actually didnt' get too much in the ideological weeds, but from what he wrote seems more of a Christian fundamentalist than left wing. Also, I would say you have been out of the United States too long and aren't really tuned in if you think any of the MSM (except Fox or maybe now CBS) are covering for Trump. I assure you the majority of our MSM feels about the same way concerning Trump as you apparently do.

Pretty sure Dunyain is here #1 for the uncomfortable ****-eroticism and #2 for the political/society ramblings.

Lately I've been thinking maybe just do men's open instead of classic because then I will never have the temptation to worry about pro qualifiers or pro cards and bodybuilding can be this fun thing I do rather than anything I put pressure on myself for or re-arrange my yearly schedule to do pro qualifiers at times that are inconvenient for my work. Less focus on the competition aspect, but focus on the "continuous art project and getting as huge and shredded as possible".

Gravitating toward more and more machines and lower training volume. Machine RDLs on a belt squat machine are sooooo good for getting glutes+hams stimulated without too much erector or bracing requirement like a barbell or dumbbell. This offseason I'm gonna let myself conventional DL a single set of 10 every other week on one of my 2 weekly leg days, however. I miss doing that lift. It was fun and with all the lower body work I do generally on pchain (hip thrust, machine rdl, hamstring curls, hack squat, leg press, glute kickbacks) just a little bit of actual DLing will probably be enough to drive progress. It'd be pretty cool to hit 230kgx10. Lifetime best was like 205x9 and 200x5x5 (in 42 minutes) I think so I'm not even far off that.

oh man i must have accidentally unsubbed this thread - i thought you went dark

going to catch up later

looking vvg. Can't be far out from the comp now?

June 14 possibly. Has prize money. But they haven't told us the date of our graduation ceremony which is compulsory for me to attend and if it happens to fall on that date I can't do the show.

It's okay. Competing isn't that important. The continuous ongoing multi-decades long art project that is bodybuilding is the end in itself.