Is the Las Vegas tourism downturn hitting the poker rooms?
Apparently this is a substantially down year for tourism in Vegas. One would think this would affect the action in the poker rooms. I haven't been out there in a while. What's the boots on the ground view of this, especially for locals / regulars. And it is effecting on and off strip equally?
Yes
Less recreationals in Strip poker rooms, so the tables have more grinders and tight retirees. Off-Strip remains reg heavy and tight retirees. Not a good time for Vegas poker.
This sounds bad.
Haven’t noticed anything.
Compared to last year the number of tourists are down, but compared to two years ago it isn’t nearly as bad as the media is making it out to be.
It is already bad and getting worse by the day …
From what I read on the internetz, Vegas is one of the worst places in the entire US to play live poker (at least for the lower stakes). I'm sure this tougher economy isn't helping things.
the people saying the games in Vegas are bad now are the same people saying the games in Vegas were bad 2 years ago.
This kinda stinks:
Good video, but it skips lightly over the most direct slap at Las Vegas' core customers .....
The entire F1 story reflects a real , knowing F. U. to regular customers, locals and workers in Las Vegas. The "regular" customers were basically told, Sorry, but we are going after EuroTrash , literally shutting down the Strip (and all the cross-streets) for both the preparation period and the race day itself.
The larger properties forgot their core market.
F1 should NOT be renewed, it literally hijacks the streets, including far more than the Strip, in favor of a marketing push for "high-end" F1 visitors.
It does so during pretty popular times for regular, historic visitors .... The larger casinos tell regulars, you are NOT who we want, stay away.
The irony is that F1 runs in other cities in a much less disruptive mode. For Christ's sake, Las Vegas has a VERY nice race track development the LVMS. The better choice than kicking regular visitors to the curb would have been to BUILD an F1 course out at the LVMS property......
(More generally speaking .... SouthPoint, far down Las Vegas Boulevard, is the large hotel, value bet for any Las Vegas visitors, and especially for POKER players.)
I've been to Vegas many times over the years and have never had a losing trip and am always blown away by how mediocre and lazy the regs are. The way lower rake than many places is always notable for me too. Vegas poker is fine.
Good video, but it skips lightly over the most direct slap at Las Vegas' core customers ..... The entire F1 story reflects a real , knowing F. U. to regular customers, locals and workers in Las Vegas. The "regular" customers were basically told, Sorry, but we are going after EuroTrash , literally shutting down the Strip (and all the cross-streets) for both the preparation perio
Yeah all good, but have you ever looked at the map and seen how many strip hotels would be affected by this (mainly by not being able to sell rooms with a view of the race for crazy prices)? If you look at that map, hmm, that's probably not going to happen. I'm not following F1 much anymore, but there are also other inner city races such as Monaco or Singapore, and these tend to be the most popular among the fans and ofc huge cash cows for any property along the way.
Spoiler
I've been to Vegas many times over the years and have never had a losing trip and am always blown away by how mediocre and lazy the regs are. The way lower rake than many places is always notable for me too. Vegas poker is fine.
Agreed. I’d say Euro regs (assuming that’s where you’re from) are on average 50% stronger than US regs, which would put a bad Euro on par with a mediocre US one.
Done like 20+ trips over the years myself, still the fact remains that tourism is way down which also reflects on the poker rooms and economy
Funny (for me good) side story:
Going in Dec again, had my room now cancelled and rebooked like 5 times (bc it became cheaper and cheaper) … they don’t give you huge discounts when everything is going great.
On the F1 topic:
Read somewhere that gambling revenue from that weekend is like 10 x compared to normal weekends, plus coming from less people (meaning average bet size is much much bigger due to highrollers).
It’s a cash cow for them, they’ll keep doing it and say FU to „normal folks“
I wonder what the game are like while F1 is in town?
On the F1 topic:
Read somewhere that gambling revenue from that weekend is like 10 x compared to normal weekends, plus coming from less people (meaning average bet size is much much bigger due to highrollers).
It’s a cash cow for them, they’ll keep doing it and say FU to „normal folks“
Giving this a bump to see if anything has changed. Has it picked up through November?
the people saying low stakes poker sucks in vegas. I don't know if that's true or not but I feel what is true is that within the last 5 years with texas poker and FL poker boomed a bit pre covid and post covid, it just made other options for other low-med stakes pretty good so its not ALL concentrated in certain regions like it used to be.
the people saying low stakes poker sucks in vegas. I don't know if that's true or not but I feel what is true is that within the last 5 years with texas poker and FL poker boomed a bit pre covid and post covid, it just made other options for other low-med stakes pretty good so its not ALL concentrated in certain regions like it used to be.
I see two options. They either suck themselves they just don’t know it or they have much better games in Florida or in Texas which makes sense.
As a European I can only dream about getting back to Vegas, the games compared to here are so insanely good.
I see two options. They either suck themselves they just don’t know it or they have much better games in Florida or in Texas which makes sense.
As a European I can only dream about getting back to Vegas, the games compared to here are so insanely good.
I believe you are correct, sir, but am interested in what makes it this way. What is it about "the European style" that allows them to crush Vegas games vs standard Euro games?
FWIW, I play a tight, somewhat aggressive, value oriented style that works in my local games as well as when playing cash in Vegas. My personal view is that most players play too wide, because "I'm not here to fold, I'm here to play!" I exploit this with patient play, and seek value with made hands, sneaking in some semi-bluffs once my image has been established. My sense based on past history is that many capable Euros, post-flop, tend to be rather aggressive, especially in position or when sensing weakness. I've developed strategies to counter this, but admittedly still get most of my value from non-Euros.
I believe you are correct, sir, but am interested in what makes it this way. What is it about "the European style" that allows them to crush Vegas games vs standard Euro games?FWIW, I play a tight, somewhat aggressive, value oriented style that works in my local games as well as when playing cash in Vegas. My personal view is that most players play too wide, because "I'm not he
Probably, and this is only a theory, lack of casinos with live poker = more online games = more online crushers. If you beat NL50 online over a decent sample size you will have absolutely zero issues with 1/3, 2/5 and maybe even some 5/10 games in the US.
How many card rooms does the US have? Hundreds if not thousands. In Europe a couple of dozen at max and only a handful of those run 24/7. And when you play the fish to reg ratio is extremely low. Take Malta as an example where me and BigWhale used to play. €1/€2 €500 cap game runs every night from 6pm. 8-9 Italian or Maltese regs and/or maybe some UK pros. All sitting silently. No drinks, no alcohol, no straddles. Just regs battling regs endlessly.
Sometimes during the bigger poker events / festivals we get some whales or fish but then the wait list gets hundreds deep.
Anyway, tldr, the most likely reason is that European poker players were raised and learned under much tougher conditions, there are no lose games around and we can take advantage of your regular rec or US fish because they are so incredibly passive it’s absurd.
Take Malta as an example where me and BigWhale used to play. €1/€2 €500 cap game runs every night from 6pm. 8-9 Italian or Maltese regs and/or maybe some UK pros. All sitting silently. No drinks, no alcohol, no straddles. Just regs battling regs endlessly.
Sometimes during the bigger poker events / festivals we get some whales or fish but then the wait list gets hundreds deep.
Can confirm this. I enjoy playing cash games and should probably play it more here in Malta, but the games on most days just look very boring. Several faces that I recogize as serious grinders and/or unknowns looking like tough European grinders. There will undoubtedly be occasional fish dropping by here and there (especially in the summer), but it's not something you can count on.
Coming to Vegas is like a fresh breath of air in comparison. Some games can be a bit tight and boring at times, but in general there are so many people like 'TopGun' described above - people who don't have the patience to sit and fold. And as long as US have a good gambling & poker culture, these types of players will always exist and flock to Vegas. Even if there are hundreds of other poker rooms around the country now, Las Vegas still have that magical attraction for most.
