Flop OESD OOP in bloated multi-way pot
Literally the first hand at the table after a table change. The table appeared a bit gamble-gamble and loose with several big stacks, but no specific reads.
1/3 (but this hand is straddled)
9-handed
eff stack 275 (me)
Hero: Kd Qh in BB
PF: Straddle on, HJ calls, CO call, BTN call, Hero w/ KQo in BB raises to 50, Straddle calls, HJ calls, CO calls, BTN calls
250 in pot going to flop (Hero w/ 225 behind).
Flop: Jh Td 8s
Hero ?
Is this just an obvious shove with less than pot sized bet left and 2 overs + OESD? Or being 5 handed is there just too little fold equity with this type of board texture?
12 Replies
Lol @ preflop result. At this stack size at a gambooley table I'm fine with it, although I don't think just seeing a flop with this hand is horrendous either.
And trivial shove for me on the flop. We're sucking up huge equity plus a shove has a smidge of FE against non TP hands. Heck, there are even times we get it in good against 9x at this table, lol.
GcluelessNLnoobG
Wow at pre-flop. Normally I like the raise assuming you thought you were going heads up. Ouch.
The flop is not great, but just shove. You have outs 😉
Rather shove now rather than waiting for an action killing turn card. You're not going anywhere whatever happens
Preflop is an excellent result. You usually need to fold when you miss, but you can gii with top pair also usually. Despite flop that hits opponents, shove should have some FE. Obviously good result if we get 2 calls.
Thanks all! In game it felt like an obvious shove w/ some small chance of taking it down and 8 outs to the nuts plus potential pair outs if called, but I wanted to see if my logic was off.
Spoiler
Hero shoves, straddle calls, CO folds, BTN calls (975 in pot). Turn and River bricks off for hero, straddle just shows Ten for middle pair and BTN shows 97 for a flopped straight.
Sometimes you need to make big favorable gambles. You were 2-1 on the flop 3-ways with large dead money. Usually better than that 3-ways, as your overcards are sometimes outs. You should take the pot sometimes, because you could be doing this with QQ+/AJ, etc.
Awful play by the player with the T. You would up with a big pot against probably 3 limping hands, suited gappers at best. That is a favorable result.
Already read through the thread and saw results, so obviously this is 20/20 hindsight...
If it's a loose, gambly table, and we're comparatively short stacked, I think I'd prefer to flat call with KQ, or just jam, rather than raising to $50, setting up a very low SPR going to the flop.
As played, yeah, seems like a pretty clear jam on the flop.
Raising preflop for value is good. Taking it preflop, getting HU, or getting 4-way against 3 junky hands are all good results. 4-way is fine, and generally gii with top pair, as well as this strong draw. Winds up a gamble often whether you make a made hand or draw. It is good to be at a gambly table, but you wind up with big flips like this one.
Might check KJo/ATo, etc. because OOP and you don't want to build the pot with a weaker hand.
I wouldn't push 275 into like 22 with any hand. Certainly not with this one. Someone could be trapping or loose passive players could limp/call with hands that dominate KQ.
I would raise AJ+/KQ/88+/all suited broadway/T9s. You could raise tighter or lighter, but checking with KQo seems a little nitty. Obviously, you often gii behind or flipping and often put in 50 and have to fold the flop, but raising good hands is profitable here.
