A 10o in SB. Why didn't I listen to everyone?
1-2nl 9 handed
H $300 SB Ad10h. Hero has raised pre a few times but hasn't won a pot yet. His Image is of a player who likes to raise pre and check and fold and lose on later streets.
3 Vs all standard recs with about the same stack size as Hero
Two early limpers and BU limps
Hero raises $17 which is standard for me with three players in.
BB folds all others call.
Flop($62 after rake) Ah 5c 5h
H bets $20. My thinking is I can get value from smaller aces, protection/value from draws, and I will hear from a player with a 5. Can one bet be a value/protection/probe bet?
First player folds. Second calls. BU fold
Turn two ways ($102) 8h
H $35
V MAWG rec snap calls
River ($172) 8s
Board Ah 5c 5h 8h 8s. Two pairs with a flush and an Ace on the board.
Hero?
7 Replies
I go bigger pre from SB, but if you have a standard I guess it's fine. I'd go at least $20.
Flop is fine, but I usually go a little more. Turn is a little small, but OK considering the flush came in. River is a bet/fold or check/call depending on opponent. I guess check/fold is an option, too, depending. Any reads?
IMO, ATo in the sb facing two early position limpers can raise, fold, or overlimp depending on table dynamics. I think at most $1/$2 games, I would lean towards folding or overlimping rather than raising.
In general, I default to checking most boards when OOP multiway. With your image, it might be especially good. You want to protect your checking range with your worst top pairs so you don't become face-up. On the turn, I would check with the Th.
As played, by the river, it's hard to imagine that there is much value left to be gotten with your hand. I might check-evaluate. It's unfortunate if he checks back A6o with the 6h, but it's pretty hard for ATo to get called on three streets here and still be good.
If I think I can thin the field, I'm going to raise bigger OOP to get fewer limp callers. If it's not going to get it down to HU, I'm going to limp with ATo.
AP, I'm not leading out bc if I was the V last to act, I'm definitely raising with ATC. Your raise pre said you don't have a 5, and my limp call says I might.
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Pre, flop fine.
Turn: We have compressed his range pre/flop and gotten HU. We don't have a three-street hand. This is a check all day on heart turn. It's not at all clear to me that we are ahead here. We already repped AK/AQ. V is unimpressed and snapped.
AP river: V will not fold to value sizing after calling two streets. On the other hand, we can have AA and he cannot. So I don't think he can raise either. Our options are:
1) polar sizing to try to push him off stuff like AJo/AQo that he might have limp/called with preflop
2) turn our hand into bluff catcher by checking and hoping he doesn't blast off. With the board pairs, I don't think he can overbet small flushes.
V has 5x and 8x and small flush. We have more nut flush and AA.
Readless, I'm inclined to x/c a reasonable bet.
My thought is river is a c/f
Is a "standard rec" Villain really going to bet worse for value or turn SDV into a bluff here? I can't think of any hands that arrive on the river as air...22-44? So doesn't that leave Villain with either value that beats us or SDV that a standard rec will just check back?
I guess V could turn 77, 99, TT into a bluff? If that's the read I guess we can call a small river bet?
Tortillarilla wrote
Is a "standard rec" Villain really going to bet worse for value or turn SDV into a bluff here? I can't think of any hands that arrive on the river as air...22-44? So doesn't that leave Villain with either value that beats us or SDV that a standard rec will just check back?
This is what I was thinking.
Spanishmoon wrote
AP river: V will not fold to value sizing after calling two streets. On the other hand, we can have AA and he cannot. So I don't think he can raise either. Our options are:
1) polar sizing to try to push him off stuff like AJo/AQo that he might have limp/called with preflop
2) turn our hand into bluff catcher by checking and hoping he doesn't blast off. With the board pairs, I don't think he can overbet small flushes.
V has 5x and 8x and small flush. We have more nut flush and AA.
IF we push him off AJ and AQ we are also pushing him off of of A9 and lower that hasn't filled up. Also unlikely V has AJ or better since he limped/called.
I don't like bluff catching here. Like Tortillarilla said V checks back hands that are behind that V would call with.
Does V have 8x. With the 8h out there the only 8s I can think of are A8 and 85. V didn't raise the flop so less likely to have a 5. This leaves A8 as the only 8 and the only full house that beats us. Not counting the quads as a possibility. V flatted the turn which could mean that if he has a flush he is afraid of bigger flushes or boats. With the double paired river he will still be afraid of boats. This allows Hero to set his price with a blocker/small value bet.
A raise after a bet on the river shows more strength than a bet after a check. Which will be easier to fold to. If Villain is one of those types that will read a small bet as weakness and will raise bluff (which I don't think this guy will, I haven't seen him make a move like this and his aggression is kinda small), Then I will fold and say this player is better than me and deserves the pot.
OTTH
Spoiler
River ($172) Ah 5c 5h 8h 8s
Hero bets $60
Villain hems and haws and rocks back and forth, mumbles something about" if calling the turn why..."
Villain calls and shows A9o with a black 9.
lol I won by the smallest of margins.
IMO, ATo in the sb facing two early position limpers can raise, fold, or overlimp depending on table dynamics. I think at most $1/$2 games, I would lean towards folding or overlimping rather than raising.
overlimp is most definitely fine, but folding is atrocious. if you overlimp, you are so much more likely to have a dominating hand rather than a dominated one. plus you are getting ridiculous pot odds at that point.